> How much is a pace?

I think the answer to this is in the faq and I think the answer was
that it is the same as a step. This was decided by a poll of the group
a long time ago. Not that that matters because some people don't read
the faq and everyone's pace/step is different anyway (e.g. kids, tho
knowing a kid wrote the clues is useful information ... with a good clue
you should use and need every piece of information presented (except for
clues that use obsfucation and cruft, but this stuff is sometimes useful
elsewhere ...)).

Anyway, good clue writers (IMHO) will give you ways to find the box without
luck and requiring inside information (e.g., how long their stride is or
whether or not they walked or took full strides, which affects pacing
distance significantly). One way (as you mentioned), was the pace
calibration leg and/or confirming landmarks.

If you don't have that, then generally you only have one or two legs
with pacing anyway (I mean, what sort of schmuck would have a clue with 30
pacing legs and no calibration or landmarks -- if you ever run into such a
monster, my advice would be to look for "invisible landmarks" or some sort
of gimmick), and you can try both steps and double steps and something
else and usually find it.

Hopefully it is "well hidden". So I can say MHO on that thread while I'm
here. Part of the fun is looking around for a hiding place. Its like
the universe has placed a letterbox for you to find, and finding such a
cool hiding place, that requires you to not disturb nature, and the hunters
not destroy stone walls and turn up every rock in the county is a real
treat. A "well hidden" box will be obvious to the hunter once they have
solved the clue. They should see the obvious hiding place when in the
vicinity, so its not a matter of luck nor a matter of turning over every
rock. I mean, some of us do letterboxing as trail running (training),
and don't have time to destroy the park ... and this can be fun for both
the hider and the hunter, that "ah" experience upon seeing the natural
hole in a log that is obviously where the box is. (Of course, not always
possible, but look for these places as both a hider and a hunter).

Now, has this ever happened to you: You go to find a good place to put
a box, and whoops, there is already one there. What is the proper
etiquette? Is co-habitation legal in such circumstances?

Cheers

I went to place a box recently and found a geocache in
the same spot. The dead tree was big enough for both
so I placed it right next to the cache.

Since we have tons of geocachers here and no
letterboxers that I know of I then put a note in the
comments section for the cache online that it was
there and to please take a look.

I also added a line to my clues suggesting that the
cache was there and to bring something to trade if
you'd like.

So far, cohabitation has been good.
--- Randy Hall wrote:
>> Now, has this ever happened to you: You go to find
> a good place to put
> a box, and whoops, there is already one there. What
> is the proper
> etiquette? Is co-habitation legal in such
> circumstances?
>
> Cheers
>


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--- In letterbox-usa@y..., Randy Hall wrote:

Thanks Randy, I had seen the "official" definition in the FAQ, but
also conflicting definitions and was just curious...

> and don't have time to destroy the park ... and this can be fun
for both
> the hider and the hunter, that "ah" experience upon seeing the
natural
> hole in a log that is obviously where the box is. (Of course, not
always
> possible, but look for these places as both a hider and a hunter).

Yes, this is a great feeling -- when you see the fallen log over
there and just "know" that is it, and you get there and peek inside
and ta-da... there is the box!

> Now, has this ever happened to you: You go to find a good place to
put
> a box, and whoops, there is already one there. What is the proper
> etiquette? Is co-habitation legal in such circumstances?

Not to me personally -- not enough boxes around Michigan for that to
happen yet, but I could see where it might in more letterbox-
populated areas.

Hmmmm, that could be interesting and a pleasant surprise to find!
Could also make for some great clue-writing possibilities (provided
of course, the person who placed the original box was okay with the
new living arrangements).

Deb (SpringChick)
P8 F7 X0

The FAQs say that the majority of letterboxers use a pace as equal to
a step. I personally find this tedious for longer distances down a
trail. Hence, nearly all my boxes in Ohio have the following sort of
statement. It should make it clear to all who search for them.

Next, take 29 paces down the trail to the East (one pace = 2 steps or
about 5 feet).

I have found that on most trails and roads and parks that there are
just about 1000 paces (my definition) in a mile, or 250 in a quarter
mile. It even helps me in knowing how much further I have to go on a
canoe portage, which are for some reason always marked in rods. (1
rod = 16 feet or so = 3 paces = 6 steps)

Go figure!

<

--- In letterbox-usa@y..., "springchick1219"
wrote:
> How much is a pace?
>
> I have seen conflicting information -- a short step, a long step,
one
> foot-fall, two foot-falls... When the number of paces is small,
the
> discrepancy caused by this inconsistency isn't great and you can
> still find your way, but as the number of required paces increases,
> so too does the margin for error.
>
> So far the clues for boxes I have hunted have been such that once I
> have taken the indicated number of paces, there is mention of an
> identifying landmark and I can then adjust my position in the event
> my pace was slightly off intention. But in the event that such a
> check-sum is not provided, I would like to be more confident that
my
> paces have carried me the anticipated distance.
>
> (Forgive me is this has been previously discussed, but it would
have
> been prior to my interest).

I like to leave indications for calibration in my clues (not that I
have written a great many, of course!), as my stride is particularly
short and I know that most letterboxers who follow me will assume a
pace to be their (far larger) footfalls... plus the fact that, in
able to simulate an 'average-sized' pace, I'd have to literally hop
along the trail, instead of simply pacing the distance out (something
that I've had to do when following other people's clues)!

On behalf of petite letterboxers everywhere, I do implore you to
calibrate your paces - or at least leave us landmarks so that we may
find our way. :)

Shipwright (Megan)

>
> Now, has this ever happened to you: You go to find a good place to
put
> a box, and whoops, there is already one there. What is the proper
> etiquette? Is co-habitation legal in such circumstances?
>

Yes! And it's a wonderful confluence of parallel vibe. 'Cept they're
both *really* mysterious letterboxes so I can't say exactly where,
but her spot is 15 feet away and "better" (see Randy's xlnt def
above) because ours keeps walking off and needing replacing.

Jay
(No stone walls were injured in the writing of this post)

springchick1219 wrote:
>How much is a pace?
>
>I have seen conflicting information -- a short step, a long step, one
>foot-fall, two foot-falls... When the number of paces is small, the
>discrepancy caused by this inconsistency isn't great and you can
>still find your way, but as the number of required paces increases,
>so too does the margin for error.

The term "pace" comes to us from the Romans. Their soldiers trained and
marched in paces, and their pace was a double step about five feet in
length. A Roman mile was 1,000 paces, or, in Latin, "mille passuum" --
which is the origin of our word "mile."

I definitely agree that a pace, whether a single step or a double step,
should never be used in a clue as a precise measure, but only to get the
finder in the right general location or point them to a unique landmark.
And regardless of whether a whether a pace is one or two steps, the
distance covered by one pace can vary greatly from person to person,
depending on your age, size and agility. The terrain can also affect the
distance of a pace, if the area is hilly or rocky or uneven.

Even if there is a consensus about what 'boxers think a pace *should* be,
there are two existing definitions, and it's a clue writer's decision
whether to use the term "pace" or not, and whether to define a pace as one
step or two. But it's the responsible thing for clue writers to let
readers know their definitions of a pace if they use the word.




|-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-#-|
Silent Doug, P15 F33 X04
silentdoug@douglasgerlach.com
http://letterboxing.gravitycloud.com